There’s been a short, pointed, discussion of gated communities (OK, Ocean Colony) in the comments on the story about the art exhibit that was held in The OC over the weekend.  I think it’s an important conversation to have, but that it belongs in its own topic.

Holding a public event in a gated community is clearly ironic. Speaking as someone who does wander into Coastside neighborhoods, both to cover news and to find out what our neighborhoods are like, I’ve never had the opportunity to do that in Ocean Colony.

I think every time I’ve done it, I’ve gotten a better understanding of the people who live in each neighborhood and the problems they face.  Ocean Colony sets itself apart from the rest of us, and I think that’s bad for the people on both sides of the (very literal) fence.

What are the effects of gates and guards on the community?  How do we feel about the prospect of more gated communities on the Coastside? Do you wish your neighborhood had gates on it?  I"m especially interested in getting the perspective of people who live in Ocean Colony.

Could we put up gates to keep just the developers out?

Living on a road that’s behind a gate, I can attest that gates are actually in the tradition of ranches on the coast!

But I can see the difference beween a gate on a ranch road and a gated community with a guard. I have been into Ocean Colony twice. Once, years ago, to an “event” and again, recently, to go to someone’s home. Both times I volunteered the information about where I was going because I wasn’t exactly sure how to get there. I received cheerful instructions.

It would be interesting to know the “protocol” for entering a gated community, or at least our local one (or are there more?). Barry, did you ever just drive up to the person in the gate house and say you wanted to drive around the neighborhood? I realize that having to state that is certainly going to put a lot of people off. I just wonder what their policy is. Do they take down every license plate number? Besides the obvious “security”, are they there for enforcement or information?

On my most recent venture into Ocean Colony (a few months ago) the person “guarding” the gate was a grandmotherly looking lady around my age. I did not feel threatened at all, though I’m sure there are some folks who would feel that way about women of this age!

Ocean Colony is not the only gated community on the Coast. I know of 2 other gated communities with access by either code numbers or key cards in, if you can believe it,Pescadero. One is on Ranch Road and the other is in Butuano Canyon.

The entrance to the Ritz has a guard there sometime but no fence.  Frewnchmans Creek has a fence around most of the area but no guard.

I know many people on the Coast look at Ocean Colony as somewhat elitist but its not. The guards are very friendly. There’s more security at airports or entering buildings in SF. For all the people who want to know what goes on beyond those intimidating gates, go there on any Sunday when they have open houses and you can see the place for yourself.

Steven Hyman

Ocean Colony’s development ordinance was passed in 1972, prior to the passage of the Coastal Initiative later that same year.  The opening day of the golf course was in 1973.  The Coastal Act was passed in 1976.  And Westinghouse won its lawsuit with the Sierra Club in 1976.  There isn’t much of a question as to whether it’s legally grandfathered or not.

    Over the years there’ve been some changes.  The golf clubhouse & restaurant (Mullins), the Colony Club, and the Hotel complex are not in the “gated” portion.  The housing area is. The Hotel’s “greeter” on Miramontes Point Road is instructed to direct anyone requesting coastal access to the free parking for same in the garage.  Following an Agreement between the City and the Homeowners’ Association reached two years ago there is now dawn to dusk access through Ocean Colony on the Coastal Trail.

    The Homeowners’ Association owns the streets, streetlights, parks & common areas, fences & gatehouse, and has a lease based footprint in the Colony Club.  The Association pays for all repairs, maintenance, and operation of the above.  The City covers sewer expenses and CCWD covers water.  Association dues run nearly $1,000 per year per detached single family home.

    The folks at the gatehouse are classified as gatekeepers, not security guards. Their instructions are to call the police if a problem arises.  They are not to directly engage in any restraint activity.  Generally speaking, gate access is for residents, visitors to residents, public officials, golf course and trades employees, and law enforcement.  There’s a real estate “looky-loo” time window currently set as Sundays, 1:00 - 4:00 p.m.

    Just thought I’d run through the basics so we’d have an overall picture of what we’re discussing.

I do not speak for any others who live in Ocean Colony, but I do not think very much about the gate or the “guards” and I tend to think this is not a very interesting or weighty issue for anyone on the Coastside.  Who besides Mr. Boville or you is really concerned or even cares?  Mr. Ferreira has pretty much touched on the significant issues, and most readers would see that there really is not much there.  Not exactly a happenin’ place.  Lots of families, dinks, empty nesters and retirees.  A significant number of the people I know in the neighborhood are extremely involved in the community at large, so the impression that Ocean Colony sets itself “apart” is a misconception.

The times I think about it most are when I hear stories like this (I cannot speak in specifics due to anticipated litigation):  a person associated with my company is being harassed by a neighbor in a MidCoast town (again, no specifics).  Not just limited to cutting his trees, but outright vandalism, threats and intimidation.  Vandalism that the perpetrator admitted to the sheriff and is evidenced by photos and video.  At that point, his recourse seems to be litigation.  I hooked him up with a great real estate litigation attorney and hope he nails the guy.  Do I have to worry about something like that?  Absolutely not.  Is that an everyday thing?  Again, no, but the disproportionately irritating or potential devastating things usually are not.  Maybe I view the “security” as some sort of flood insurance.

Of course, OC sets itself apart from the rest of the Coastside.  Otherwise, to quote Ronald Reagan for the first time in my life, “Tear down that wall, Mr. Ginna!”

My question is whether its a good thing for the community. One thing I’ve noticed when I’m there is the sense of being someplace other than the Coastside.

If you’re having a dispute with your neighbor, I’m not sure your homeowners’ association (or any power on earth) has the power to save you.

Unfortunately the story I related is not run-of-the-mill dispute resolution but something much more tragic.  Am I protected? No.  Do I feel as if I am?  Yes.  Peace of mind goes a long way.

“My question is whether its a good thing for the community.”

Still seems very odd that that question is being asked when it has been around for 30 years.  How would it be a “bad” thing?  It is a collection of homes.  On to more important matters.

We live in the OC and the only substantiated negative we have heard is when the guards are occasionally rude to guests (which is really unacceptable). They’ve gotten better recently, or so our guests tell us, which is nice.

Everyone lives in different places for a reason. I happen to like Ocean Colony although it was an accidental choice on our part (right place/right time) but would also love to live up in the highlands of El Granada where the rich people live (but they dont have sidewalks or level ground, its a tradeoff I suppose).

That to me is the biggest misconception, people think that everyone who lives in ocean colony lives in a McMansion when, fact is, Ocean Colony ain’t got nuthin on some parts of El Granda. Spyglass is a very small piece of our mostly late 1970’s constructed community (if you set aside the attached townhomes) but people seem to assume that OC -is- SpyGlass.

We do know that this is the place with the most sense of community that we have ever experienced. We regularly eat with my neighbors, we know the local kids, we help each other on a regular basis, we watch each others children and we all look after one another. On our street one person even blocks the cul de sac off on the weekends so the kids can have room to spread out which is fantastic. This community is incredible really and one of the things that keeps us in Ocean Colony.

It is a very tightknit community regardless of how it is perceived outside.

Barry Parr - 10 October 2006 09:08 PM

My question is whether its a good thing for the community. One thing I’ve noticed when I’m there is the sense of being someplace other than the Coastside.

 

Its not more good or bad then any of the other diverse communities on the coastside with their own quirks.

I feel like I am somewhere ‘else’ when I go to El Granada and see the million dollar homes perched on hills with italian marble floors, I feel like I am somewhere ‘else’ when I go to Arleta Park and see homes with 8 cars parked in front of them. I feel like I am somewhere ‘else’ when I drive through Princeton and see light industrial on the harbor.

The Coastside has many ‘Communities’ making up a larger picture with a large variety, each with pros and cons, the Coastside is not one homogonized ‘Community’. Its those differences that make it so much fun.

A typical outsider’s reaction to Ocean colony would be: Stepford. Yawn.

Though gated communities are usually thought of as overly artificial, overdeveloped places with a fence to keep out the riff-raff, there are also gated tracts of land where the rules are used to strictly limit development, limit disruptin of the landscape, and limit population density. One I visited near Sisters, OR, is nothing like the usual stereotype and probably the most sensible “subdivision” I have ever seen (this from a guy raised in the slurbs). Other such communities are springing up in Western states, some using a technique of relatively clustered development in a less sensitive area and the vast bulk of the acreage left alone in perpetuity.

It’s not really a discussion that directly affects most people because of the minority of people who can afford a place in a gated community (or almost anyplace else in the Bay Area for that matter). As for whether or not a gated community is “good” for its area, doesn’t that depend on the imposed design and conditions of a given development? New gated communities are out because the midcoast is already mindlessly, tragically overdeveloped. But I can envision gated communities carved out of existing communities on the midcoast that would turn the tables on the ongoing destruction of overdevelopment, free themselves of some of the bad aspects of city and county government with their quasi-governmental community rules, and emphasize community processes that would lead to more positive, sustainable relationships with the landscape. When communities are in charge of themselves, life in those communities is almost always better. If it takes gates to achieve that, why not?

Carl May

Carl - makes perfect sense to me.  Most would also yawn at our Dutch Colonial.

John - I could not make it, but my wife Julia brought our 16 month old daughter Annie to Lizzie’s party.  Thanks again!  (*see how much community there is…)

So, I’m curious. From the point of view of an OC resident what purpose does the gate itself accomplish? Surely not “building community” within OC—the development is sort of off on its own and the single access road would seem to accomplish that. Is it a fear of crime? Is it some sort of sense of living somewhere “exclusive”?

Obviously there is more than one person living here on the coastside that questions the value of the fence and gate to our wider community (or, more accuratley, questions whether that fence/gate is a positive value)—so despite efforts by a few people here to end the conversation I do think it worth a few minutes of our time.

For OC’ers, keep in mind that the gate may have been there for 30 years but gated communities have taken on a special symbolism within the past decade or so—sort of like Hummers. It’s more than just a car and a gate is more than just a gate.

—Darin

As a former resident I’d say there’s some stuff to think about in your statement.
The person on the outside of the gate who feels excluded will feel it strongly.
But the person on the inside of the gate is barely aware of that feeling because the exclusion on his part isn’t personal, it’s more generalized.  I don’t live there any more but now that I don’t I’d say it’s the exclusion of transient traffic, the exclusion of happenings such as the bicycle that disappeared from my side yard a few weeks ago, or the exclusion of listening to a Harley start up and take off at a full roar before 6:00 a.m. 6 days a week.  But I can honestly say that I never felt that living in Ocean Colony was a class system thing.  It was more of a getaway from some of the irritants of society.  And when you’ve got small kids, those things have weight.
When I lived there and was on the Board we’d often have discussions about what to do about the negative perceptions outside the gate.  In addition to encouraging OC residents to participate in the community at large and trying to keep the front gate from appearing zealous we also encouraged the golf course ownership to be supportive of junior golf and the high school golf team.  They’ve done that and they’ve also been very cooperative with local charity efforts almost from their beginning.
I understand that those things don’t do away with the perception of exclusion.  But I also know that asking for the front gate to go away is a non-starter.  If the reduction of that perception is to be a goal it’ll need a different solution or solutions.

During the time I lived in a large condo complex in Playa del Rey, then installed a pretty nasty fence and locked gates.  We had on-site security roaming the grounds.  Nothing helped.  There were too many entrance gates to have them guarded.  People didn’t know their neighbors.  I suspect that what makes OC safe as has been described above is the single point of entry combined with a warm body sitting there.  (I didn’t even realize until this thread that it was a single point of entry.)  Also important to security is the sense of community that’s been described.

When I got fed up with the idiots in the condo upstairs, I bought a house 4 miles away in a typical (ungated) middle-middle class neighborhood.  Sometimes I’d forget to close my garage door at night.  To my knowledge nothing was ever stolen.  The topology of the street plan (no through traffic on my street) and the stability of the residents were also likely key factors.

There are still people in El Granada who don’t lock their doors.  I’ve forgotten on occasion to close my garage door and I don’t think anything’s been stolen.

I can see the advantages that Mike describes with not having unwanted 6 am wakeups.  And I bet residents don’t park their commercial business trucks on the street in OC.  I’m impressed that OC is actually able to enforce things—my PDR condo board wouldn’t deal with anything that wasn’t a gross violation of CCRs, and then only if it involved the common areas.

I did live for ~8 years in a small city (pop 25,000) with a good city council and a top-notch police force.  It was practically like living in a gated community.  Unfortunately they didn’t ban leaf blowers until years after I moved away…

Up until 1989 the Association was controlled by the Developer (Westinghouse until ‘85. McComas until ‘88. then OCP). From the point at which the homeowners took control, however, the Association has taken a role in trying to shape developments to reduce impacts on the residents. There were some stressful times in the early ‘90s but, in recent years, most issues get worked out early in the process. The presentation that Barry taped and put up on this site demonstrates that.

EDITOR’S NOTE:  I’ve removed a comment from this thread for violating Town Hall’s civility rule.

Let’s confine the discussion in this topic to the role of gated communities on the Coastside. If you want to discuss the rule or its application, I’ve set up a separate topic under About Coastsider for that purpose:

http://coastsider.com/index.php/townhall/viewthread/43/

It’s not well known that within Ocean Colony there are three smaller associations of townhouses which own their streets separately from the larger association.  There’ve been occasions when the smaller associations have asserted that ownership. 
    For instance, in the late 1980s the developer of the Eagle Trace subdivision connected one of his streets to the street owned by the Bay Hill Association without permission, and claimed that his permits from the City and the Coastal Commission were all that he needed.  Cy Roumanis, a retired schoolteacher of philosophical bent but a man also well described as stalwart, led his association into court against the developer and won.  Street ownership is street ownership, it seems. A barrier was ordered by the court.
    The larger association and the fire marshal tried to get into the act and get rid of the barrier but Cy stood his ground. Finally, the fire chief, Ron Delgado, negotiated a compromise with Cy: a landscape island barring passage but which a big fire truck could charge through if it had to.  Cy passed away not long after that but the island is still there.

Mike